Ai Uehara retiring...

Ghostbird

Make Somalia great again!!
Mar 28, 2015
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It's not worth YOUR time? You tell me I don't know what I'm talking about and then you tell me to read her autobiography to find the answer because you didn't know why she retired either.

And then you can't answer any of my questions, so now it's not worth your time...

Just don't bother reading any of my posts, because you're wasting my time!

If you're so worried about the poor women that are being abused by the jewish illuminati reptilian yakuza that control the world, don't cry wolf about abuse without proof.

0cf.jpg
 
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Supmop

Akiba Citizen
Oct 23, 2012
3,955
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Well here's the quote from the article I found, you tell me...

"
icon9.gif
[So Sad]Just watch Ai uehara crying as she speaks out the reasons on retirement.
So sad to see her speaking as she tells the reasons of her retirement in the video...
She said she is very tired of the past 5 years and ever since her debut, she is thinking when to retire.
frown.gif
sad.gif
sad.gif

She tells about the constant abuse she gets and how she tolerate it with just a smile"

and the link to the page
http://forums.hardwarezone.com.sg/eat-drink-man-woman-16/[so-sad]just-watch-ai-uehara-crying-she-speaks-out-reasons-retirement-5382125.html

If she's not talking about "abuse", then what exactly is she talking about?

I laugh after I read it :D

after someone believed Maria Ozawa is a transexual now we got something to be laugh again :D

Abuse was the reason I read, so that's what I'm going with.

another funny opinion :D
 
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paparoach408

Akiba Citizen
Jun 14, 2012
1,011
717
I'll say All I know is from all the stuff I read her see from when she announced her retirement to her final day, yeah she had thought about retiring from an early stage, because well for her she legit worked from the bottom, with no major backing to the top was likely going to retire the year she won the top actress award, that's the only reason she continued on for another year, didn't want to leave the fans hanging so pushed on, though she was happy about everything she achieved. There's a chance the abuse may of happened in her early days, but when she hit the top there was 0.00% chance anybody in the industry would do that, or it could've been fan abuse, and threats which a lot of girls get, I won't discard the abuse thing, but she never spoke of it her retirement was probably from fatigue, and not having anything left to achieve.
 
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ding73ding

Akiba Citizen
Oct 25, 2009
2,337
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Hmm I wrote a huge post and decided to junk it... just mention a few point... bottomline is I shouldn't waste so much time thinking and posting things to this discussion...

1. incest isn't illegal in Japan. Filming and selling a vid showing lesbian and/or straight incest involving siblings or parents don't seem to violate any Japanese law, esp. if it passed the industry ethics committee.

2. I still haven't seen any semi-credible report of Ai Uehara making accusation about industry or studio or person with specific abuse or mistreatment. Whatever is supposed to have been said could be just a simple case of burnt-out or exhaustion, or simply she's lost some of her top star money earning superpower. Speculating her real reason for quitting is about as definite and useful as debating the real reason Pope Benedict retired.

3. about the "off-script" scenes I'm with @alexkiallys at least some of these hardcore scene really do seem like genuine mistreatment of the actress. Unlike the Western S&M world where a safeword is set up so that during every single second of every scene, consent of every single participant is guaranteed. So far I have not heard of any safeword arrangement when filming AV, and it's pretty clear that some of the scenes, the complete scenario was never pre-explained and agreed-upon before filming and the scenario being played out. So sometimes things go wrong such as in AVOP-117, as the scenario played out and Aika was fucked and creampied, fully in accordance with the "rules of engagement", she suffered a break down and cried uncontrollably. The perverse thing is that the director and editor devote many minutes documenting her crying and other crew members trying to settle down her emotions. (it's pretty clear that during the whole filming, the amount of footage shot was many times more than fit on a single DVD title, so it was a conscious decision to cut a lot of other footage but kept this "off-script" emotional breakdown. And in general, including other off-script scenes @alexkiallys saw the sadistic thing is that actress's suffering or fear or rejection is what the director want to film and what the paying customers want to see.

4. what should we do, if any, now that we learn about real or imaginary malpractice cases such as Fujiwa(?) and if, a BIG IF, Ai Uehara really has a nasty éxposé to make. Or Aika's genuine-looking breakdown. I think if I focus on those, without context, it's right to be outraged, and maybe do something about it. The bare minimum might be to quit it, Stop buying, stop download, stop watching JAV. A more righteous action might be to raise a stink about it, I really think the footage in AVOP-117 itself is bad enough to raise hell if someone were to take it to UN-something-something commission or some kind of Christian feminist crusade organization. Even if I may not take this action, or quit a decades-long addiction just on moral ground... seriously... if I truly convince myself that women were hurt for the AV, I really think it will cause me erectile dysfunction.

But, I wouldn't do any of that... myself. The Aike crying scene, the Fujiwa report, without context, look really bad, but if I consider the context, well it seems these girls all have the option of quitting (actually aren't we right now arguing over Uehara's reason for quitting), perhaps not any random day (Fujiwa's contract penalty etc) but given some time and preparation, any actress can quit eventually, perhaps getting help from simple religious groups (e.g. the group that "helped" Fujiwa) Since all the ladies involved made a lot of AV vids (at least Aika and Uehara did) during and after the (alleged) mistreatment, I feel comfortable taking that the women themselves accept or tolerate the mistreatment in some sense.

The way I think of it, Aika did not explicitly refuse to participate when the AVOP-117 scenario was explained to her, on-screen. Then the game starts, and she was caught, and therefore was fucked, and either during or before or even right after she got fucked she became very unwilling, and she was distressed and breakdown... But if she went back, almost immediately to making more AV, a lot of sex scenes were even (pretend) non-consensual sex... well I take that as retroactively giving consent to her "r***" in AVOP-117.

So what's happening is perhaps "she didn't sign up for that" (quoting alexkiallys) at that moment, she was unwilling to do certain sex with certain males (or objects!) but she agreed to some kind of sex film before, and after the distress during the filming, she came back to the studio and continue to make more sex films. Perhaps she's agreed to be mistreated (exceeding her willingness during the filming) for pay? Professional abuse/torture/mistreatment subject, how about that?

It may be very tricky mental exercise to make a distinction between Aika coming back for more and more (AND MORE) sex films justifying the abuse/mistreatment capture (and sold!) on AV, and the case of choir boys molested by Catholic priests and came back to the Church every Sunday, maybe for years.

Well once again I've written too long a post... so let's just say I managed to work out why I rage against Catholic molestation case but tolerate alleged abuse by AV industry. I might even go home tonight and re-watch Aika getting non-consensual fucked and either it causes erectile failure or if I can orgasm, I am guessing I can.
 

Blade Runner

Well-Known Member
Sep 12, 2015
384
268
Hmm I wrote a huge post and decided to junk it... just mention a few point... bottomline is I shouldn't waste so much time thinking and posting things to this discussion...

1. incest isn't illegal in Japan. Filming and selling a vid showing lesbian and/or straight incest involving siblings or parents don't seem to violate any Japanese law, esp. if it passed the industry ethics committee.
I'm recalling Marina Matsumoto and 'daughter' lesbian scene. Marina goes to town, FIV, and tongue her on co-star. IMO it's difficult to believe they are mother-daughter after watching that scene.

2. I still haven't seen any semi-credible report of Ai Uehara making accusation about industry or studio or person with specific abuse or mistreatment. Whatever is supposed to have been said could be just a simple case of burnt-out or exhaustion, or simply she's lost some of her top star money earning superpower. Speculating her real reason for quitting is about as definite and useful as debating the real reason Pope Benedict retired.
Porn star retirement equals papal retirement.

3. about the "off-script" scenes I'm with @alexkiallys at least some of these hardcore scene really do seem like genuine mistreatment of the actress. Unlike the Western S&M world where a safeword is set up so that during every single second of every scene, consent of every single participant is guaranteed. So far I have not heard of any safeword arrangement when filming AV, and it's pretty clear that some of the scenes, the complete scenario was never pre-explained and agreed-upon before filming and the scenario being played out. So sometimes things go wrong such as in AVOP-117, as the scenario played out and Aika was fucked and creampied, fully in accordance with the "rules of engagement", she suffered a break down and cried uncontrollably. The perverse thing is that the director and editor devote many minutes documenting her crying and other crew members trying to settle down her emotions. (it's pretty clear that during the whole filming, the amount of footage shot was many times more than fit on a single DVD title, so it was a conscious decision to cut a lot of other footage but kept this "off-script" emotional breakdown. And in general, including other off-script scenes @alexkiallys saw the sadistic thing is that actress's suffering or fear or rejection is what the director want to film and what the paying customers want to see.
Sativa Rose had a similar on-camera experience. She was getting drilled when unexpectedly she began to cry. Sativa couldn't stop crying. Director kept camera on her. I've seen it once and prefer not to see again.

4. what should we do, if any, now that we learn about real or imaginary malpractice cases such as Fujiwa(?) and if, a BIG IF, Ai Uehara really has a nasty éxposé to make. Or Aika's genuine-looking breakdown. I think if I focus on those, without context, it's right to be outraged, and maybe do something about it. The bare minimum might be to quit it, Stop buying, stop download, stop watching JAV. A more righteous action might be to raise a stink about it, I really think the footage in AVOP-117 itself is bad enough to raise hell if someone were to take it to UN-something-something commission or some kind of Christian feminist crusade organization. Even if I may not take this action, or quit a decades-long addiction just on moral ground... seriously... if I truly convince myself that women were hurt for the AV, I really think it will cause me erectile dysfunction.

But, I wouldn't do any of that... myself. The Aike crying scene, the Fujiwa report, without context, look really bad, but if I consider the context, well it seems these girls all have the option of quitting (actually aren't we right now arguing over Uehara's reason for quitting), perhaps not any random day (Fujiwa's contract penalty etc) but given some time and preparation, any actress can quit eventually, perhaps getting help from simple religious groups (e.g. the group that "helped" Fujiwa) Since all the ladies involved made a lot of AV vids (at least Aika and Uehara did) during and after the (alleged) mistreatment, I feel comfortable taking that the women themselves accept or tolerate the mistreatment in some sense.

The way I think of it, Aika did not explicitly refuse to participate when the AVOP-117 scenario was explained to her, on-screen. Then the game starts, and she was caught, and therefore was fucked, and either during or before or even right after she got fucked she became very unwilling, and she was distressed and breakdown... But if she went back, almost immediately to making more AV, a lot of sex scenes were even (pretend) non-consensual sex... well I take that as retroactively giving consent to her "r***" in AVOP-117.

So what's happening is perhaps "she didn't sign up for that" (quoting alexkiallys) at that moment, she was unwilling to do certain sex with certain males (or objects!) but she agreed to some kind of sex film before, and after the distress during the filming, she came back to the studio and continue to make more sex films. Perhaps she's agreed to be mistreated (exceeding her willingness during the filming) for pay? Professional abuse/torture/mistreatment subject, how about that?

It may be very tricky mental exercise to make a distinction between Aika coming back for more and more (AND MORE) sex films justifying the abuse/mistreatment capture (and sold!) on AV, and the case of choir boys molested by Catholic priests and came back to the Church every Sunday, maybe for years.

Well once again I've written too long a post... so let's just say I managed to work out why I rage against Catholic molestation case but tolerate alleged abuse by AV industry. I might even go home tonight and re-watch Aika getting non-consensual fucked and either it causes erectile failure or if I can orgasm, I am guessing I can.
+1 until religious tangent.
 
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Casshern2

Senior Member...I think
Mar 22, 2008
7,020
14,460
She will come out of retirement in 2018 and make many leg and ass titles for my enjoyment. So sayeth I.

I just hope she lives a good life the rest of her days. Of course...I would forgive them all if they had to coerce her to make some Madonna titles as a MILF later...
 

alexkiallys

Member
Nov 14, 2010
67
62
ding73ding , I appreciate your post. I still stand by what I stated earlier because the way men can be, any woman can be subjected to abuse. It doesn't matter to me about her name, fame, wealth or anything else.

Because men abuse women all the time. Every part of the world. Let's not act it doesn't happen.

Men for the most part, men know how other men think.

It might not be something we want to acknowledge, but usually we know how other men think.

And guys usually don't give a shit about what other men do unless it somehow affects them or someone they know personally or someone they care about.
Men can come up with some really nasty, depraved sick things to do to women. I'm not saying women can't do the same.

Considering how women are abused in everyday life, I don't see why the movie industry would be immune to this.

I've been aware of Japanese porn since the mid 1990's and there's one theme I've ALWAYS seen...

Non consensual sex (r***, gang bang, taking advantage of a drunk woman etc...)

If doesn't matter if it's a schoolgirl, business woman, teacher, undercover cop, "grandmother" or even a nun!

Because like I stated before, even if a woman agrees to do a film...

I've seen women get a dick rammed into their mouth with such violence, it made me cringe.

I've seen women actually be thrown down, have guys restrain her, pry her legs open, a guy stick his dick in her pussy with force and fuck the shit out of her.

I've seen women bent over, a guy spits in his hand, rub the saliva on his dick and then ram it up their ass just like that.

And there are times I've see a woman with a dick in her mouth, pussy and ass, all at once!

Now these could be very realistic scenes with good to great actors, but I don't see how that could feel good to a woman. Maybe it does. But that right there looks like some form of abuse.

And considering how some women seem to be fucked by at least 3 or 4 guys in just one movie. The physical, mental, emotional and psychological toll it must take going through it time and time again.

And it's not as if every actress likes working with every actor. There are some guys she might've worked with before who mistreated her or heard about someone's reputation and is worried as to what he might do.

So the point of non consensual sex in porn. There an audience that likes it and I'm pretty sure there are guys who live vicariously through these actors. Who like seeing women roughed up.

And what about the actors themselves?

I'm not saying these male actors are rapists, but there's one actor. (the bald guy who usually wears a beanie and has a stud in his ear)
Just about every time I see him in a movie, he's "raping" a female. Sometimes it pretty violent. Usually it starts on a train or a bus and sometimes he drags the woman somewhere else.(restroom)
Now, he could be a very nice guy off camera and a really good actor, but the mind set it takes to be a r**ist in film after film...(yikes!)

And if a guy is working with an actress (top star or not) who he might not get along with or he sees her as some sort of conquest to brag about, yeah, I see some guys taking liberties, knowing he has all these other male actors with him to use as intimidation and a male director who just wants to finish his film.

So to reiterate my main point, if women can be abused in everyday life, I don't see how an actress can go unscathed in the porn industry where one of it main movie themes seem to be r*** and exerting power over a woman.

Art imitating life
and
life imitating art.

And how many "fans" really care about these actresses? I'm sure there are some, but others only care about these women while they're masturbating to their favorite scene.

And when they're done, they go do something else and forget about the woman until...

he wants to use her to get off again,

hear news about her next film

or
becomes "heartbroken" when she retires.
 
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paparoach408

Akiba Citizen
Jun 14, 2012
1,011
717
ding73ding , I appreciate your post. I still stand by what I stated earlier because the way men can be, any woman can be subjected to abuse. It doesn't matter to me about her name, fame, wealth or anything else.

Because men abuse women all the time. Every part of the world. Let's not act it doesn't happen.

Men for the most part, men know how other men think.

It might not be something we want to acknowledge, but usually we know how other men think.

And guys usually don't give a shit about what other men do unless it somehow affects them or someone they know personally or someone they care about.
Men can come up with some really nasty, depraved sick things to do to women. I'm not saying women can't do the same.

Considering how women are abused in everyday life, I don't see why the movie industry would be immune to this.

I've been aware of Japanese porn since the mid 1990's and there's one theme I've ALWAYS seen...

Non consensual sex (r***, gang bang, taking advantage of a drunk woman etc...)

If doesn't matter if it's a schoolgirl, business woman, teacher, undercover cop, "grandmother" or even a nun!

Because like I stated before, even if a woman agrees to do a film...

I've seen women get a dick rammed into their mouth with such violence, it made me cringe.

I've seen women actually be thrown down, have guys restrain her, pry her legs open, a guy stick his dick in her pussy with force and fuck the shit out of her.

I've seen women bent over, a guy spits in his hand, rub the saliva on his dick and then ram it up their ass just like that.

And there are times I've see a woman with a dick in her mouth, pussy and ass, all at once!

Now these could be very realistic scenes with good to great actors, but I don't see how that could feel good to a woman. Maybe it does. But that right there looks like some form of abuse.

And considering how some women seem to be fucked by at least 3 or 4 guys in just one movie. The physical, mental, emotional and psychological toll it must take going through it time and time again.

And it's not as if every actress likes working with every actor. There are some guys she might've worked with before who mistreated her or heard about someone's reputation and is worried as to what he might do.

So the point of non consensual sex in porn. There an audience that likes it and I'm pretty sure there are guys who live vicariously through these actors. Who like seeing women roughed up.

And what about the actors themselves?

I'm not saying these male actors are rapists, but there's one actor. (the bald guy who usually wears a beanie and has a stud in his ear)
Just about every time I see him in a movie, he's "raping" a female. Sometimes it pretty violent. Usually it starts on a train or a bus and sometimes he drags the woman somewhere else.(restroom)
Now, he could be a very nice guy off camera and a really good actor, but the mind set it takes to be a r**ist in film after film...(yikes!)

And if a guy is working with an actress (top star or not) who he might not get along with or he sees her as some sort of conquest to brag about, yeah, I see some guys taking liberties, knowing he has all these other male actors with him to use as intimidation and a male director who just wants to finish his film.

So to reiterate my main point, if women can be abused in everyday life, I don't see how an actress can go unscathed in the porn industry where one of it main movie themes seem to be r*** and exerting power over a woman.

Art imitating life
and
life imitating art.

And how many "fans" really care about these actresses? I'm sure there are some, but others only care about these women while they're masturbating to their favorite scene.

And when they're done, they go do something else and forget about the woman until...

he wants to use her to get off again,

hear news about her next film

or
becomes "heartbroken" when she retires.

I don't think anyone is saying that girls don't get abused against there will within the industry, just ones at the top are unlikely, it would more likely happen to a no name girl who can't make a difference. We saw what happened when a mid level girl(who by the way did many many more videos after) who talked about being forced into the industry, and a lot of things have been canceled, and some form of change is upcoming someone with a bigger platform would probably bury what the current jav industry is. Like there's probably legit more abuse in the idol industry(music, acting,modeling) then in the jav.

Now these could be very realistic scenes with good to great actors, but I don't see how that could feel good to a woman. Maybe it does. But that right there looks like some form of abuse.
Also on your complaint on the genre, it's not for you and that's fine but other people like it(watching or performing it) not all girls like vanilla sex, some like rougher things or might be interested in trying it, it's not abuse just because you don't like it.

And it's not as if every actress likes working with every actor. There are some guys she might've worked with before who mistreated her or heard about someone's reputation and is worried as to what he might do.
Also there are list where girls ok what guys they want to work with, same with guys but for obvious reasons they aren't that large.

So the point of non consensual sex in porn. There an audience that likes it and I'm pretty sure there are guys who live vicariously through these actors. Who like seeing women roughed up.

isn't living through that fantasy better then say the audience going out and roughing others up? Like with Cheating themes, or heck movies in general.

So to summarize everything you're saying it's just you don't like the r*** genre and still haven't proven that Ai quit because of abuse
 
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alexkiallys

Member
Nov 14, 2010
67
62
I don't think anyone is saying that girls don't get abused against there will within the industry, just ones at the top are unlikely, it would more likely happen to a no name girl who can't make a difference. We saw what happened when a mid level girl(who by the way did many many more videos after) who talked about being forced into the industry, and a lot of things have been canceled, and some form of change is upcoming someone with a bigger platform would probably bury what the current jav industry is. Like there's probably legit more abuse in the idol industry(music, acting,modeling) then in the jav.


Also on your complaint on the genre, it's not for you and that's fine but other people like it(watching or performing it) not all girls like vanilla sex, some like rougher things or might be interested in trying it, it's not abuse just because you don't like it.


Also there are list where girls ok what guys they want to work with, same with guys but for obvious reasons they aren't that large.

isn't living through that fantasy better then say the audience going out and roughing others up? Like with Cheating themes, or heck movies in general.

So to summarize everything you're saying it's just you don't like the r*** genre and still haven't proven that Ai quit because of abuse

I think your "summary" is wrong. I like the "chikan" theme (which I've mentioned on occasion) which can turn into r***. But when it's turns into a gang bang or gets hardcore, I don't want to see it.
And that's my preference.Some things I can watch, other things I don't like... Just like anyone else.
So let me make that clear.

You say I didn't prove Ai Uehara quit because she was abused, but no one seems to prove that she wasn't and that was my point. And people keep wanting me to change my opinion and they can't give me facts.
You said it's "unlikely", that a top name girl would be abused but you didn't say it wasn't possible.

I said I don't see how certain things could feel good to a woman, like triple penetration, but then I said maybe it does. Which means I'm giving my opinion. I didn't say there wasn't a woman who didn't like it. And it wasn't a complaint, it was my opinion.

You said "Isn't fantasy being better than the audience going out and roughing others up?"

What exactly are you arguing?
You're repeating what I said in a different way.I said that guys live through the actors on screen. But there are some guys might actually do what they see in a movie.I guess that's a complaint too.

When I stated that
"Life imitates art
and
art imitates life."

That means it goes both ways.Movies can be inspired by real life events and people can be inspired by movies.

You keep saying I'm complaining, well if I wanted to complain , I would say I hate Japanese porn, but do I say that? No!
Didn't I mention that I've been into it since the mid 1990's? Yeah, I did.
Considering that I probably have over 5 or 6 terabytes of Asian porn that I've collected over the years. (which I mentioned in the past)
Why would I be interested in something I don't like for over 20 years?

If I want to complain, then I can and if someone doesn't like it, then they can go elsewhere.

Did I say people shouldn't look at Japanese porn? No!
Considering I've recommended movies to other members over the years that wouldn't make sense, would it?

Did I say people shouldn't like the r*** genre? No!
Considering I've recommended "non consensual" types of movies to other members that wouldn't make sense either.

I don't care if people don't like my opinion, because it's my opinion. If they want argue against it, go ahead, I don't know what they think they're going to prove. And if they don't like my comments, then no one is forcing them to read them.
 

Supmop

Akiba Citizen
Oct 23, 2012
3,955
1,923
You say I didn't prove Ai Uehara quit because she was abused, but no one seems to prove that she wasn't and that was my point. And people keep wanting me to change my opinion and they can't give me facts.
You said it's "unlikely", that a top name girl would be abused but you didn't say it wasn't possible.

1. you're wrong, I don't want you to change your opinion, so I still can have something to laugh :D

2. there a lot of retired AV idols who made comeback, thats the fact, how come they comeback if they feel abused

a lot girls has made dozens videos, including the one who claimed has been abused or brainwashed in AV, they are not slave, they can stop ASAP if they don't feel comfortable anymore

3. you seems don't know the fact that females like to play victim

4. lot of the girls in JAV oftenly look like they has been forced to do it, give expression they not enjoying the sex, they cried, look like they feel painful, ecc but its only part of the acting and seems a lot of JAV audiences love that kind of girls

they are pro, the slapping, rough play, ecc are part of their job

studio pay their actors and actresses not to feel pleasure but to perform

5. and for Ai Uehara, she get retired after she won the best actress, and she done a lot of special retirement videos, thats the fact she was not abused
 
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ding73ding

Akiba Citizen
Oct 25, 2009
2,337
2,092
OK... actually on the bigger issues of "men vs. women" I'm more than a little sympathetic to your views, but in Akiba Online I am not interested to discuss gender politics. Or even bigger: human nature. I'm not young myself, but I'm a bit shocked myself, that my outlook on humanity and morality is still changing, at my age. Quite unbelievable, when I was 15 I was absolutely sure I knew everything there's to know about society and politics. On gender issue, let's just say, I was and still am (almost 100%) sympathetic to the way you feel but now I'm older and confused, I don't think full-on feminism (?Hilary?) is working out, but clearly going back to chauvinism (Trumpism) isn't going work either. Yeah old and confused.

On purely the matter of porn, I'm with you, a lot of JAV (fans) confuse abuse with eros. This is very unhealthy of the class of Japanese men (and women) who consume these types of JAV. I ranted about this many times already. But this does not affect my actions, other than I'm careful about choosing vids. Also if I had chance, I'd discourage any female friends or relatives to work or live in Japan, but that's hardly necessary, most non-Japanese women I encounter already have a clear view of women status in Japan.

I'm actually disagreeing with @paparoach408 about how rosy it is for established stars. From what I understand even big stars, top stars in mainstream media get heavily managed and constrained. So how could be better in the darker world of sex industry? OTOH, there's a laws of jungle at works here. Most AV actress career are very short lived (average might even be less than a year) so the industry need to recruit fresh faces constantly. If the reputation of industry takes too much damage their whole business model may collapse. (1) social stigma against AV performer may increase, (2) potential recruits get scared by both abuse happening to them and the increase social stigma, (3) government may take intervention.

So yes some bad things are happening but it can only be self-limiting. The point is that Japan is kind of a planet unto itself. Accepting and handling "abuse" is part of growing and maturing and developing one's worth, especially in some professions such as sumo. It's tempting to point to certain things and say that's pretty fucked up, but it's their internal affairs. And the whole system, with the good parts and bad parts in it, produces some amazing exports (AV, anime, manga, games). (there used to be a lot more: tech, music, art, cuisine etc, but in recent years those have been much less impressive) I'm a consumer of those export, I'm not so sure the value of these exports can be separated from the particular bad things that we may discover. If they are some kind of reform from within, and if they welcome my contribution in some way, yeah I will give it. But I am not going to stick my nose in there and tell them how things ought to be.

Like we all admire Apple the company (even if I've never purchased any Apple product), but could Apple be Apple without massively relying on poorly treated Chinese workers? In an "ideal" world everyone will get a fair wage and decent food, medicine and rest days, but also probably only 10%, not 90%, of the population can afford smart phones.

I'm very worried that in an "ideal" world, not just men, also women will be bored to death in the matters of love and sex. On sex being absolutely 100% consensual, I think the pendulum has already swung too far from reality and common sense. The concept of "abuse" or "r***" should not have an external fully objective legal definition. It need to takes into account the context and especially the tolerance level of the subject (latent victim). AV idols quit and become OL or house wife all the time, the exit route is there, I give trust and respect to Japanese women to choose for themselves if they want to enter the industry and when to quit.
 

Supmop

Akiba Citizen
Oct 23, 2012
3,955
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OK... actually on the bigger issues of "men vs. women" I'm more than a little sympathetic to your views, but in Akiba Online I am not interested to discuss gender politics. Or even bigger: human nature. I'm not young myself, but I'm a bit shocked myself, that my outlook on humanity and morality is still changing, at my age. Quite unbelievable, when I was 15 I was absolutely sure I knew everything there's to know about society and politics. On gender issue, let's just say, I was and still am (almost 100%) sympathetic to the way you feel but now I'm older and confused, I don't think full-on feminism (?Hilary?) is working out, but clearly going back to chauvinism (Trumpism) isn't going work either. Yeah old and confused.

On purely the matter of porn, I'm with you, a lot of JAV (fans) confuse abuse with eros. This is very unhealthy of the class of Japanese men (and women) who consume these types of JAV. I ranted about this many times already. But this does not affect my actions, other than I'm careful about choosing vids. Also if I had chance, I'd discourage any female friends or relatives to work or live in Japan, but that's hardly necessary, most non-Japanese women I encounter already have a clear view of women status in Japan.

I'm actually disagreeing with @paparoach408 about how rosy it is for established stars. From what I understand even big stars, top stars in mainstream media get heavily managed and constrained. So how could be better in the darker world of sex industry? OTOH, there's a laws of jungle at works here. Most AV actress career are very short lived (average might even be less than a year) so the industry need to recruit fresh faces constantly. If the reputation of industry takes too much damage their whole business model may collapse. (1) social stigma against AV performer may increase, (2) potential recruits get scared by both abuse happening to them and the increase social stigma, (3) government may take intervention.

So yes some bad things are happening but it can only be self-limiting. The point is that Japan is kind of a planet unto itself. Accepting and handling "abuse" is part of growing and maturing and developing one's worth, especially in some professions such as sumo. It's tempting to point to certain things and say that's pretty fucked up, but it's their internal affairs. And the whole system, with the good parts and bad parts in it, produces some amazing exports (AV, anime, manga, games). (there used to be a lot more: tech, music, art, cuisine etc, but in recent years those have been much less impressive) I'm a consumer of those export, I'm not so sure the value of these exports can be separated from the particular bad things that we may discover. If they are some kind of reform from within, and if they welcome my contribution in some way, yeah I will give it. But I am not going to stick my nose in there and tell them how things ought to be.

Like we all admire Apple the company (even if I've never purchased any Apple product), but could Apple be Apple without massively relying on poorly treated Chinese workers? In an "ideal" world everyone will get a fair wage and decent food, medicine and rest days, but also probably only 10%, not 90%, of the population can afford smart phones.

I'm very worried that in an "ideal" world, not just men, also women will be bored to death in the matters of love and sex. On sex being absolutely 100% consensual, I think the pendulum has already swung too far from reality and common sense. The concept of "abuse" or "r***" should not have an external fully objective legal definition. It need to takes into account the context and especially the tolerance level of the subject (latent victim). AV idols quit and become OL or house wife all the time, the exit route is there, I give trust and respect to Japanese women to choose for themselves if they want to enter the industry and when to quit.

we get older, we get more experiences, and we realize that actually still lot of things we don't know yet

yes I agree with you, how come more and more girls come to work in AV if they know bad stuff happening in it, and surely government will take intervention, they don't have much productive generation now

accepting and handling "abuse" is part of growing and maturing and developing one's worth -> totally I agree, life isn't always fair

AV idols quit and become OL or house wife all the time, the exit route is there, I give trust and respect to Japanese women to choose for themselves if they want to enter the industry and when to quit. -> :top:
 

paparoach408

Akiba Citizen
Jun 14, 2012
1,011
717
You say I didn't prove Ai Uehara quit because she was abused, but no one seems to prove that she wasn't and that was my point. And people keep wanting me to change my opinion and they can't give me facts.

I say that Ai Uehara has 32 children! you have no facts to disprove it, so i'm not changing my opinion! who ever needs proof these days. I also believe that Supmop and ding73ding are the same person
 

lpcs1

Suffers from semenly incurable Narutophilia
Dec 7, 2012
639
623
what was the name of her last title ? :eek:
 

Casshern2

Senior Member...I think
Mar 22, 2008
7,020
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