No surprises here....

You have me very wrong.
...
I think we got off on the wrong foot and I say "Let's start this relationship all over again." What you say, partner?

Well I'm glad one more person in the world agrees with somethings. But actually it makes no difference to me. I only write posts and respond to posts, I don't respond to person (someone I've never met). I might have misunderstood your post, but you admit it's a reasonable misunderstanding, and happens on the net all the time.
I did not judge you, believe it or not. I did not judge you because I don't care about you. I don't even care if you believe or not believe I don't care. I only responded to the post, and OK, I did misunderstand it.

But I did say and mean "judges and censors" not "judgement" (nor censorship) so thanks for the unneeded sic. I was talking about law enforcement who might be brought in by Christian activist groups (go read that BBC article again) to exploit a private commercial friction into some anti-sex, anti-porn witchhunt. I don't know why you think I was talking about your judgement or your religion.
 
Interesting points made on this thread and it's great to see people willing to share their real genuine thoughts regarding not only the sex industry but society as a whole.

For me 99% of the sex industry is just a mirror of male sexual desire and fantasy. The actresses are hired to perform for the wants and wishes of men. Sure females will watch porn, and of course there are many studios dedicated to porn for female tastes (whatever that may be), but most of it is due to the wanton desires of men.

Porn will always exist as men will always desire and demand it, and to satisfy that demand there must of course be women to star in those movies. Ultimately it's all about just how studios go about hiring these women to become JAV actresses. I'm sure most of the woman who become JAV actresses do it because they want to, whether because they want to achieve fame and adulation. Others will do it for money of course, either because it is far easier and better paying than getting a regular job.

Just like in the real world though, there will always be men who look to exploit woman for their own needs, whether that be for money, sex or both as in the case of the sex industry. Of course there will be women out there who have been coerced into the industry, just as women are taken advantage of in the real world, because ultimately peoples greed will always bring out the worst of their nature.

Ultimately, we as the viewers and purveyors of porn are the ones responsible for the greater demand. We want to see more and more fresh talent to satisfy our desires and are willing to be blissfully ignorant of the possible 'dark' side of the industry, as long as we get our fix. I, personally, am extremely grateful of the large amount of incredibly beautiful actresses around in JAV right now and rarely do i put any thought in how they entered the industry, why they chose to do it or how much they are being paid. I am just happy to watch and enjoy.

Now i know for most of you my thoughts may not be along the same way you feel and i certainly don't mean to be implying that this is how we should all think. I know i have used the pronoun (i think) 'we' a lot but these are just my thoughts and feeling on the matter, even if it wasn't directly related to the Hitomi case itself.
 
(this thread has gone down a weird road)
I absolutely do not understand you. Perhaps my speaking tone makes you uncomfortable? Perhaps @galactus got uncomfortable? I think it's great to read, to think, to express. Agree or disagree, it's a good exercise. There's no win, lose or draw, misunderstandings can be corrected, it's far more interesting to say your pieces, and see how it goes, rather then keep a distance to avoid potential uncomfortable or misunderstanding.

What I see last few weeks (1) this one Hitomi/agency story generated three threads in this forum, (2) there was the case of male AV fan-performer stabbing an idol, (3) the ex-AKB48 trainee (Yua Hikami) making AV and saying something about her past, (4) discussion about Yua and other AV performer working as prostitutes. It's almost enough to construct a conspiracy theory that "dark forces" are attacking porn and sex industry. So it's a good place to figure out how we (yes, we, why not? of course we may not all share agreement) see this whole ball of wax.

This thread is hardly about one Hitomi Fujiwara case or even collection of few cases. It's the legal, ethical, moral question of sex industry.

About @Motiman 's post, I think it might be an interesting exercise to re-think the whole thing and switch out sex for something else, like caffeinated beverage. My point is that we (actually by we I really mean Y'ALL ;))have been brainwashed into treating sex differently from other commercial products like coffee or limo service or investment advice. If you look at objectively the sex industry is cleaner and nicer than most so-called mainstream respectable business or political sectors.

Why can I say that? Well it seems the worst that those anti-porn activists can come up with is Hitomi case, which is... come on... it's far less fucked-upped than your typical Hollywood or Broadway behind-the-scene dirty secrets. Only it's sex so suddenly a little inappropriate pressure tactics become this big deal.

There was this other interview of a soapland worker (i.e. hooker) who said it takes a lot of intelligence to be successful soapland hooker and she has a whole practical career plan that will see her to her retirement with a comfortable and rewarding professional and private life. I like to see a world that if a young woman want to (or perhaps just try out) a sex work career, it's comparable to when a young man tells his parent he's gay. A bit uncomfortable OK, but not totally outrageous or scandalous or disappointing.

What I like about Stoya's angle is that we are entering (hopefully?) this post-feminist, post-sexual-revolution era. I like that a snobby-upper-classy magazine would publish a big article on a porn star as a person and a careerist maybe even an artist or thinker, not as a victim (but I dislike the title of the article). I think we should fight the brainwashing that "male sexual desires and fantasy" is the root of some kind evil and victimize these girls to enter this shady world and blah blah. What truly victimize these women are not AV buyers or agency or studio or johns or pimps or mama-sans. What truly piss me off is these tabloid journalists and police and judges and lawyers and politicians who do everything they can to make AV performers and hookers feel bad about themselves, to make the society to look down on them.

Today's women are strong and powerful, these people who claim to protect women (how curious fundamentalist Christians and Muslims are united on this) really want to strip women of their power and their worth.
 
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Like one hooker I talked to, after I fucked her and were talking. She said she doesn't like being a prostitute and told me about the nasty things that she has to endure. I ask her have you tried quitting, she said "yeah a couple times. But then I had to work, and I hate getting out of bed before 11AM and a lot of work needs me standing up for hours! so when I ran out money I came back" She was outright cheerful when saying this. I laughed and told her a tiny bit about how hard I work and said "now you need to suck my cock until I get hard and I'm gonna fuck you because you want the money in my wallet so you can get out of bed at 11AM and work lying down."

I know some call girls that don't have pimp, don't use middle man, set their own price and she get 100% + tips, so I can say many of them are not forced into this kind of work, its their own choice

many of them give excuse that her parent are sick, need to pay the bills, ecc buat actually they want to get a lot of money to buy expensive gadgets, clothes, shoes, bags, ecc

some of them said want to quit, want to do honest jobs but don't want to work for hours and want easy light work with big payment :D

What truly piss me off is these tabloid journalists and police and judges and lawyers and politicians who do everything they can to make AV performers and hookers feel bad about themselves, to make the society to look down on them.

Today's women are strong and powerful, these people who claim to protect women (how curious fundamentalist Christians and Muslims are united on this) really want to strip women of their power and their worth.

absolutely agree with this ;)
 
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Today's women are strong and powerful, these people who claim to protect women (how curious fundamentalist Christians and Muslims are united on this) really want to strip women of their power and their worth.

using women that aren't beef goblins on adverts is now forbidden in the obesity capital of europe.

http://www.bbc.com/news/uk-england-london-36516378


CYJMk6gUkAAHFh0.jpg

this is somehow impossible to achieve

unrealistic body 2.jpg


of course this law only applies to women, using men who are on massive amounts of drugs is okay

unrealistic body.jpg

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Today's women are strong and powerful, these people who claim to protect women (how curious fundamentalist Christians and Muslims are united on this) really want to strip women of their power and their worth.

using women that aren't beef goblins on adverts is now forbidden in the obesity capital of europe.

[...]

of course this law only applies to women, using men who are on massive amounts of drugs is okay

Don't forget about fundamentalist feminists.
 
using women that aren't beef goblins on adverts is now forbidden in the obesity capital of europe.

http://www.bbc.com/news/uk-england-london-36516378


View attachment 719217

this is somehow impossible to achieve

View attachment 719213


of course this law only applies to women, using men who are on massive amounts of drugs is okay

View attachment 719214

View attachment 719215

View attachment 719216
That video is so ridiculous it makes me angry! :mad::mad::mad:
So just because another person looks better than you, that's now body shaming??? WTF?!
How about this... rather than wasting your time and energy protesting why don't you put that effort into eating a proper daily diet and hitting the gym a few days a week. Maybe then you can look like the woman in the ad and you'll be the one adored and envied instead. Jeez simply ridiculous.
 
I used to be a Europe supporter, partly because Europorn is better. But they have gone and fucked themselves up. UK is leading the match to hell, one end you have fat lesbians telling everyone beauty and health is bad, then you have the angry white men counter with Brexit.
 
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I used to be a Europe supporter, partly because I'm from Europe. But then I saw Cyndi Wang and now I'm a Cyndi Wang supporter.

(That was my attempt at pointing out how offtopic this conversation has become.)

(But to be honest, it was really just an excuse to mention Cyndi Wang again.)

(But I do support Cyndi Wang. This post is an example of how I tend to do it on these forums.)​

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That video is so ridiculous it makes me angry! :mad::mad::mad:
So just because another person looks better than you, that's now body shaming??? WTF?!
How about this... rather than wasting your time and energy protesting why don't you put that effort into eating a proper daily diet and hitting the gym a few days a week. Maybe then you can look like the woman in the ad and you'll be the one adored and envied instead. Jeez simply ridiculous.

To reach the ideal body for males as portrayed in the mainstream media, they would need to do heavy training every day of their life.
But for females? All they need to do to reach that "unrealistic" body ideal is not eat like a damn pig.

These feminists want to make themselves the new norm. Rather than put in effort to reach the healthy body ideal, they would try to bring all other women down to their own level.

Even fictional women aren't safe from this:
http://money.cnn.com/2015/07/24/technology/realistic-video-game-bodies/
https://i.redd.it/nc5q8fbk2v6x.jpg
They are demanding female fictional characters to either fit their ideal or be censored entirely.
 
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I don't think the problem with those ads is the fact there is beautiful woman or man in the picture, but rather the text accompanying them, or combination fo text and picture.

And if you seriously think that Protein World products are the answer to obesity, then you are not very smart. Those ads do not offer a solution to obesity. They are misleading at best, just like a lot of ads would be without government regulation. If only feminists are against misleading advertising, then call me a feminist.
 
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I don't think the problem with those ads is the fact there is beautiful woman or man in the picture, but rather the text accompanying them, or combination fo text and picture.

And if you seriously think that Protein World products are the answer to obesity, then you are not very smart. Those ads do not offer a solution to obesity. They are misleading at best, just like a lot of ads would be without government regulation. If only feminists are against misleading advertising, then call me a feminist.

So misleading advertising is only okay if it's aimed towards men?

The whole supplement industry is based on men who are on massive amounts of drugs selling bullshit whey brotein.

I don't see any politicians ever trying to pass any laws against that, only laws against the drugs that they use so they have to lie about their drug use and sell expensive bullshit waste products instead.
 
I take supplements (Whey Protein) because I do weight lifting. Of course in the sport industrie, the are tons of fake products and they do anything to sell amount of useless products to people. You just need to do be smart and read informations online on dedicated forums (for example). Personally, I did researches before choosing supplements. Thanks to that, I understood that 90% of bodybuilding products are bullshit, that's why I use only Whey Protein to "supplement" my diet (again, I looked for a good brand, not the first price whey).
Being in shape is important for me because it keeps you healthy and prevent pains and discomforts (back, shoulders, ...).

In France, the new trend for guys is to have a "dad bod". Even on TV they talked about it. "Girls" find it attractive. Haha, of course because they can be less strict on their diet as well and eat cookies, ice creams, chips all day long without feeling guilty. I see people of my age getting that belly and it's sad. People are lazy. Yes it's easier to sit and watch TV or drink a beer with friends. But you can hit the gym only 1-2 times a week, have a good diet all week and just have a cheat meal on sunday and that's about it (if you aren't into sport).
 
So misleading advertising is only okay if it's aimed towards men?

I never said such a thing.

The examples you posted of men are not ads on the London Tube. They are not ads at all. They are magazine front covers. Magazine front covers sometimes have naked women. Very beautiful naked women, with minimal controversy. An ad trying to sell a specific product from a specific company on the London Tube is completely different.

The Tube and Muscle Fitness magazine controlled by completely different organizations. The government of the City of London has completely different standards and rules than the editorial board of Muscle Fitness magazine does, as well it probably should.

Transport for London is a public non-profit organization, funded by taxpayers, providing a public service, while Muscle Fitness magazine is privately-owned, operating for profit. I don't understand why you would think TfL and Muscle Fitness should have the same standards.

Muscle Fitness is a privately-owned magazine with a very specific audience. The Tube is a publicly-owned subway/metro system used by everybody. It is ridiculous to even compare them, let alone using them as way to attack feminists and argue that men are discriminated against.
 
I never said such a thing.

The examples you posted of men are not ads on the London Tube. They are not ads at all. They are magazine front covers. Magazine front covers sometimes have naked women. Very beautiful naked women, with minimal controversy. An ad trying to sell a specific product from a specific company on the London Tube is completely different.

The Tube and Muscle Fitness magazine controlled by completely different organizations. The government of the City of London has completely different standards and rules than the editorial board of Muscle Fitness magazine does, as well it probably should.

Transport for London is a public non-profit organization, funded by taxpayers, providing a public service, while Muscle Fitness magazine is privately-owned, operating for profit. I don't understand why you would think TfL and Muscle Fitness should have the same standards.

Muscle Fitness is a privately-owned magazine with a very specific audience. The Tube is a publicly-owned subway/metro system used by everybody. It is ridiculous to even compare them, let alone using them as way to attack feminists and argue that men are discriminated against.

Brotein world is privately owned.


And the women are not naked, they often even have more clothes on them than men do.

unrealistic body 2.jpg

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HOW DID A THREAD ABOUT AV STARS TURN INTO PICTURES OF ARNOLD, KAI GREENE, AND 'AIN'T NUTTIN BUT A PENAUT' RONNIE COLEMAN???
 
I'm a Cyndi Wang supporter.
(That was my attempt at pointing out how offtopic this conversation has become.)​
Ok... you made your point, and ... the topic drift continues...

Personally I think topic drifts are OK as long as posts remain at least minimally respectable, and it's a gradual drift, not totally non sequitur.

I admit my eurorant may be a bigger drift than normal... From the OP I wanted to rant about society intersection with porn/sex industry. At least I hope we (as porn/sex consumers) can have a more sensible view on sex, morals and gender issue.

But in the greater society there are deep and widespread distortions and isn't getting better, contrary to expectation from my youth, from end of Cold War. And this general reverse-progression in economy, politics and society is similarly reflected in porn and sex. Or more specifically the OP (Hitomi Fujiwatever) is a study case of societal distortions inserting themselves into the porn world.

As for the drift into body building supplement industry... I'm totally lost.