Western Porn Bringing JAV to Mind, and How Well They Succeed

[Supmop]

And when it come to non reluctance scenes , I would use the word "finesse" for JAV , they seem to be able to do it just right.
I tried NC scenes on western porn , its actually quite extreme on both ends. They either do it too urm ... enthusiastically , its really kinda bad , I don't really want those cute ladies to get hurt. =( and not to my taste
or the other end of the scales (which is more than 80% of case) , where I can't figure out who is raping who... the victim seem to be one the "doing" the r**ist with all the "yeah baby , give it to me.. yeah yeah"
"maybe western female empowerment" even in porn?

yes porn might represent the society

like in oldies JAV we rare to see interracial action, because most of japanese older generation still can't accept relationship with non japanese

Now modern western porn plot is what u see on the cover man. Any historical piece like "Cleopatra" , the only historical indication u ever see is the cover. I would say the after exchange are all quite similar to the first western porn I have seen.
I think the title is something like , The pool cleaner and the dentist's wife. Wow some cool story eh?
Well I saw the wife on a beach chair beside the pool and a hunk walking beside the pool. If he cleaned the pool by walking around the pool , i guess he IS a pool cleaner. And to this day I remember the conversation. it goes something like this
Hunk - "Hi there , how are you?"
Wife - "Great , good day isn't it?"
Hunk -" Yep , great day , u wanna fuck?"
Wife - "Yeah baby"
Sleazy music and well the action goes on.

I guess if you got abs like the hunk , you can be a pool cleaner or a road cleaner and still get the hotties. Till this day I still haven figure out where/who is the dentist.....

if you see productions from big studios with big budget, you will see much more ... not only the cover

for example Private, they have shooting locations around the world, some of them are beautiful landscape, while most of JAV location are in Japan

 

[needs more loli]

That pornhub video looks like a direct copy of the popular Rocket videos. Sounds like the West is slowly taking more and more ideas from JAV.

So when are they going to catch up in the loli genre *muhahaha*
To answer my own question: probably never, but I hope for more petite girls in Western porn like Veronica Rodriguez in her early days or Little Lupe pre-implants. What cute little firecrackers they were.

I haven't found males in JAV to be less attractive than males in western porn. I watch a lot of crossdressers and I find that mostly in JAV but I have some from the west too. I think maybe people don't think that Asian males are as attractive as white or black males, and you can see this in the lack of major roles for Asian males even in normal mainstream films, and perhaps I speak from personal experience as a Asian male myself. If you want the most attractive males you have to watch gay porn, and that is true in both JAV and western porn.

I wouldn't say Asian males are less attractive, but I would have to say they in general they do look a lot less masculine. Keep in mind I'm saying this as an Asian male myself with my skinny ectomorph wrists, and baby face.
Being less masculine looking in porn does have one advantage however, it makes for some amazing newhalfs. You'll probably never find a White or Black newhalf as cute as the girl from HVG-020. I've fapped to newhalf porn before but good God this girl blows my mind (and load ). How can he be so cute!
Warning: Newhalf! Don't click the spoiler tag if you are easily offended and don't say I didnt warn you.

Spoiler

 

[Motiman]

Great thread and although i don't have the time to give you particular examples i do agree with the sentiment that European porn is closer to JAV than US porn. My thoughts immediately go to the productions of studios like Private, Dorcel and especially Salieri during the 90's and early 2000's. Back then we would get full scale movies that were always interesting and not afraid to tackle difficult subjects including r***, incest, blackmail and schoolgirls. Sadly these studios have declined in recent years and tended to favour more gonzo type movies although Dorcel do still produce the odd gem here and there.

 

[Motiman]

I remember watching a few videos a few years ago from a small European website called WesternChikan which as you can tell focused on molesting and groping women in public places. Sadly the site seemed to be pretty low budget as many scenes (especially their later work) were clearly just filmed in someone's living room but many of the earlier videos actually did take place in actual buses or movie theatres. As a big fan of chikan i did enjoy them when i could find them online as this wasn't just about getting down to action as soon as possible, they did take their time to slowly progress the scene just like they do in JAV. I'm sure you've seen the movies by Natural High or Dandy (or pretty much every major JAV studio) where the scenes can go on for the best part of an hour

The action did differ from scene to scene in regards to how far they went. Some just had groping and rubbing, others went as far as handjobs and blowjobs, and the odd rare one went full whack but it was rather inconsistent as was the quality of the actresses sadly. The thing that stood out for me is that they did seem to take the public groping element seriously, with many of the women playing the part of the helpless victim getting touched up against their wishes. You would see the guys going up to the women and begin by simply rubbing themselves against the girls before progressing to touching and groping them. Some would remain with the women fully clothed throughout but often you would actually get to see some exposed titties which was always a bonus as these guys were clearly focused on the more ample bosomed actresses.

I don't have the movies any more (or i just can't find them right now) but i have tried to find some examples online just now to give you guys an idea of what i'm talking about. The scenes were often split up into bite sized chunks so it will be hard to get complete scenes but i will try to find the best ones.

One of my favourites has to be this one starring Nikita Valentin. A stunning blonde with a cracking body, just love the cute little outfit she has on with the tight top and skimpy skirt. They even try to put a little story context which gives it that little boost as we have a reason for her being there and why she has ended up surrounded by these perverts. You can see during the scene that she isn't happy with the attention she is getting and constantly tries to bat away their groping hands to no avail. The fact that this scene just consists of her getting groped and nothing else (not even her boobs get exposed ), and yet it remains soooo erotic is a testament to how much having the right setting with the right girl in the right scenario can be.

http://www.xvideos.com/video1711032...la_tchekan_cinemagropers_orangeshirt_complete

Another one of hers but not complete, this time she is in a lovely yellow dress and yes we do get a glimpse of her boobs but as it's not complete it does detract from the video slightly. Still hot though.

http://www.xvideos.com/video17755583/cinema_grope_0909v

Short but sweet this one but love the sexy pink dress. No idea who the actress is and would really like to find the whole scene for sure.

http://flashservice.xvideos.com/embedframe/678757

This is a JAV site i know so i'm not going to flood this post with videos but these next few videos where we see the girl getting groped by a molester only to then get blackmailed by another guy who spotted them was another highlight. Note the look of boredom and disdain on her face as she has to deal with the constant groping and rubbing from these old geezers.

http://www.xvideos.com/video6356644/old_gropers_-_antonya_2_

http://www.xvideos.com/video6356625/old_gropers_-_antonya

http://www.xvideos.com/video6356661/old_gropers_-_antonya_3_

 

[miasman15]

As an Asian (of Chinese descent) myself, I will tell you that cute non-asian shemales exist. You'll find a lot of them in amateur porn. Been searching for stuff like these since 2007. You have to go beyond the more-mainstream sources to see them.

 

[natsuxdragon]

One thing western needs to add is lots of male and female performers kissing and it has to be passionate.

 

[asdfaznz]

The one other thing western porn needs is intensity with the male and female performers. Most of the female performers don't really sound like they are into it and their moans and orgasms sound incredibly fake. The male performers are also at fault for this because they lack the athleticism and energy as asian or black performers. You can make all the "asian small penis" jokes you want, but they know how to work with what they have! Some of them like Shimiken really give these girls a good pounding. The only western male actor I've seen to match is Rocco Siffredi.

 

[kharo88]

Most of the female performers don't really sound like they are into it and their moans and orgasms sound incredibly fake.

I totally agree! But I don't like the way that most Japanese women moan either... it doesn't sound sexy to me at all, so I think there's room for improvement there for both regions! (Regions? I guess.)

 

[Supmop]

The one other thing western porn needs is intensity with the male and female performers. Most of the female performers don't really sound like they are into it and their moans and orgasms sound incredibly fake. The male performers are also at fault for this because they lack the athleticism and energy as asian or black performers. You can make all the "asian small penis" jokes you want, but they know how to work with what they have! Some of them like Shimiken really give these girls a good pounding. The only western male actor I've seen to match is Rocco Siffredi.

but japanese females moans are sound more fake than the western porn

 

[jugulear]

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An example of Western porn that brought JAV to mind.

A woman in the situation of having sex with dirty bums is not one that JAV has invented. The first time I came across this kind of scene was in the delightfully depraved Emanuelle Around the World (1977), starring Laura Gemser.


A senator sets up a beauty pageant contestant (Miss Ohio, played by Juliet Graham) by stripping her and throwing her into the midst of homeless men, for the amusement of his entourage of rich creeps; things get out of hand. This YouTube video may be available for viewing outside the USA.

On the other hand, JAV has created a niche of this genre, with their countless "Grotesque Men" movies. A couple of threads have been devoted to the topic here on "Discussion," including "With Homeless Guys" and "Hot JAV Actress Has Sex with Disgusting Men." An example is Homeless Japan Boundless Pure Nakadashi - Homeless People Vs. Nozomi Hazuki [DVDES-469] (A 543 MB painless download)



I ran into this "Bound Gangbangs" episode from 2012 that brought the genre to mind:

First Date, starring Coral Aorta


In this fantasy role-play Coral Aorta plays a girl going out on a first date with a kinky older man. In the restaurant he makes her play with her pussy under the table. Excited by this experience she follows him to an unknown location where she is blindfolded and cuffed with her hands behind her back. While she is bound helpless and unable to see she begins to smell the stench of the location.......Her seemingly gentlemanly date suddenly takes a dark turn and pays a group of homeless men to fuck and humiliate her! This is Coral's first DP, FIRST DOUBLE VAGINAL PENETRATION, and FIRST GANGBANG! Don't miss it!

Naturally, this is a whole different animal than JAV; for one thing, JAV-makers cast the most repulsive looking men for their Grotesque Guy movies, and those such as pretty-boy James Deen (among others playing the homeless) don't quite cut the mustard. Still, there is a moment where the "kinky older man" who sets up Carol Aorta ("Aorta"? What kind of a moniker is that... sounds like humor in a Jugulear vein) takes snapshots of the lady, and that's an appreciated touch, rare as picture-taking is, in Western porn. (227 MB).

A couple of notes on actresses I have mentioned whom I've taken a liking to, given their "exaggerated" performances. One, Britney Amber, appeared in another KINK production from their Whipped Ass end, entitled Hot Bitch Boss Relieves Stress with Submissive Slut Assistant! (also starring Chanel Preston), and I thought it was quite wonderful. It was not quite as wonderful as this JAV That Got It Right, which also takes place in an office situation (although the victimized one is the boss, which I find more satisfying), but the story element and the way it was handled were well done.

Another actress I've spoken of was Callie Calypso, who has appeared in a "Helpless Teens" episode... pulling off another effective performance (screen shots). I've never heard of Helpless Teens, but I was surprised to find this rare display of "f***rced sex within a story setting" in Western porn. Another series produced by the same studio which has promise is called "Brutal Castings."


EDIT:

A JAV I have run into that brought the EMANUELLE movie to mind:



Vagabonds' Sexual Abuse Report Girls Became Lust Vent For the Homeless [GQR-054]


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[jugulear]

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I've caught several episodes of the "Brutal Castings" series mentioned in my last post, and I was struck by how the "casting director" performed a very familiar maneuver.



He managed to make a little fluid come out of Jade Dylan.

In the case of Skye West, she actually squirted as a result of the frantic back & forth hand action.



If I have ever seen this technique in Western porn, I do not remember. I'm not saying it has not existed before, but usually manual stimulation is achieved through a vibrator, notably the Magic Wand.

So here is one instance where it's a good guess how JAV has influenced Western porn.

I watched a few more episodes, and I'm heartbroken how tattoos have become a rule with these young and often new-to-the-scene American porn actresses. Some have sadly really overdone it, too; just what are they thinking? Do they actually believe they look more attractive? (Thank God this practice has not caught on with Japanese porn actresses.)


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[kessari]

weee pc went bonkers afk for quite a while. Finally back, so a wall of text. Bear with me guys =D

I must say I really didn't know there're actually western-chikan type vids until motiman's post. Kudos to Motiman.
Checking those out , I must say they are promising , but still quite not as there as JAV chikan.
It would seem that most of the vid , the victims would just keep a straight face while the gropers were at it. I would imagine some genre of groper's style where the girls keep a straight face and pretend nothing happening. (TBH that is a great genre, if they can do it right)
However it seem more like they are still in the "green" stage of transformation from where they keeping all they could from changing back into "Oh Yeah baby, give it to me" switch and keeping a straight face is their current stage of "chikan" evolution.
But still its innovative , I do hope they improve on it.

and after checking out Jug's post on brutal casting a/m on Skye West. The start really look promising =D . But it soon spiral down into a distasteful mixture for me personally. The bondage rope are great idea , but the manhandling aint. I really hope put more effort into story and acting rather than brutalization realization. The AV actor strangulated poor Skye into a purple-red hue many times during the vids. But this IS brutal casting after all.


There are many scenes in JAV where bondage and NC and roughplay are required. But they never give me stomach upturns squeamishness as when I watch western porn on the same genre. Personally one of the reason I feel is that JAV actors do respect the actresses which they work with which are very lacking in western porn. But each to his own , JAV might actually be too "mild" n another person view..mmmm. But I guess thats why the west really need some kinda of female protection laws. There are really some really violent sickos.


And an western film with bullying students on a teacher?(Jug post on Luna Lombardi) Really gotto check it out!! I must say Italians really got the ideas.

Great thread and although i don't have the time to give you particular examples i do agree with the sentiment that European porn is closer to JAV than US porn. My thoughts immediately go to the productions of studios like Private, Dorcel and especially Salieri during the 90's and early 2000's. Back then we would get full scale movies that were always interesting and not afraid to tackle difficult subjects including r***, incest, blackmail and schoolgirls. Sadly these studios have declined in recent years and tended to favour more gonzo type movies although Dorcel do still produce the odd gem here and there.

Can't agree more more , they got the juice , but rather that they would not think out of the box , the problem is they "can't" think out of the box. Alot of genre in JAV now would be certainly frowned upon in western culture.
A good topic to discuss would be shotacon genre. There are many vids like the RCT http://www.dmm.co.jp/monthly/premium/-/list/=/article=series/id=212221/
Mostly they just get a mosaic-ed small sized adult actor and put a childish cap on him and pass him off as a extremely young boy. Any portrayal of juveniles in sexual environment even if the juvenile is the protaganist is extremely sensitive in western culture. Unless you want FBI kicking down your front door and flooring u with dozen tasers. I might be wrong but I think the reason why Japan use adults rather than boys is more on labor laws hehehe..

This is MEYD -127 starring Yui Nishikawa where she was terrorized by her stepson when he found out her weakness (sorry for the w/m)

those Japanese definitely have no problem portraying kids in uniform. And that's no high school uniform man
But of coz if anyone really wanna go into the legal issues. Seriously this show is about a seriously deranged middle age man who like to dress up in kids uniform... hehehehehe

And while most western vid about stepson forcing on stepmom usually end up in the "oh yeah give it to me baby" scene.

I have no idea Yui can display such a helpless cornered face !!! SWEEET
The desolation, helplessness cornering of predator and prey. Nicely done

Frankly I preferred the JAV way.

But to be fair , the Italians really got to the nearest. Before all the juvenile protection and female empowerment stuff ,there were the age of sexploitation films era in Italian cinemagraphy. And there was Malizia!!! Italian shotacon

(My eternal goddess, the late Laura Antonelli. I will bow to her forever.)
Laura played a middle age housekeeper who was sexually terrorized by Alessandro Momo who is portraying a 14 year old boy I think. Yep not sure what is his actual age. But definitely a law suit case in current western culture. Malizia is by no means porn but definitely a movie worthy of https://www.akiba-online.com/threads/movie-review-areolas.1608186/#post-3222899 if it's was japanese porn =D

The iconic scene where Alessandro tried to pilfer Laura's panties in front of everyone during lunch
and she tried to stop him in vain.

And forcing her to undress in front of her overweight buddy and make her seduce his father so she become his stepmom forever. Not exactly h/c porn but certainly a lot of great ideas and creativity. It will be interesting to see what the Italians can achieve if they were not constraint by the social norms and rules of current age.

 

[jugulear]

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Fantastic post, Kessari, thank you... and thank you for going the extra mile with your pictorial dressings.

I appreciated learning about MEYD-127, and now I'd like to get my hands on it... as well as its predecessor, MEYD-084. (-127 and -084, each for around 300 MB.)

The Italians really got some things right with their no-excuse perversions from the glorious 1970s. I wasn't aware of MALIZIA, and I'm going to look into getting that as well. (3 parts, 400 MB.)



One of the former Axis nation's (is this why the older Italian movies succeed with a JAV flavor?) more potent productions from that period was 1976's SUBMISSION with Franco Nero. (Coincidentally, I watched 1966's BLOW UP today, as I had not seen it in years; I later learned its star, Vanessa Redgrave, married Franco Nero — with whom she had a son back in 1969 — very late in life, in 2006! Now how romantic was that?)



The talk on MALIZIA made me recall a movie from the United States just a few years later, called PRIVATE LESSONS (with Sylvia "Emmanuelle" Kristel, also no longer among us, as is sadly the case with MALIZIA's sexy star) which bore some similarities, chiefly in regards to the lady also playing a servant (although the kid was not malicious, so the movie was not all that erotic; the English for "malizia," by the way, is "malicious"). So as late as 1981, Americans were still cool about the adult woman and teen-aged boy idea. (Around the time of MALIZIA's release, no American had a problem with the colossal hit, SUMMER OF '42; that also played with the same theme.)



Soon after the era of Ronald Reagan got underway, Americans started getting so hysterical about the idea of "pedophilia," there were even outcries against 1979's German classic, THE TIN DRUM (which featured a brief "encounter" between an adult trapped in a boy's body and a teen-aged girl.) Some were clamoring to get the movie out of the libraries... and they say ignorance is bliss.





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[Motiman]

Thanks for the posts guys and letting me know of 'The Monster Stepson' series but having looked at the screenshots i was disappointed to discover that it seems they have just taken a regular actor, blurred his face and dressed him up in childish clothes to act as the shota actor.

A true shota movie needs to have a realistic actor to portray the young man and in this respect the two actors in these movies just won't do. I mean look at the pictures below. The two actors are clearly bigger and taller than the actress which simply defeats the whole purpose of a shotacon movie.

I recently wrote about DVDES-699 as i was looking to have it translated and you can clearly see that the actors (although a little creepy looking) certainly look the part.



As for the movie Malizia, wow it looks great! I'm pretty sure i've seen that scene before online though i can't recall seeing the full movie.

Another Italian movie you must check out is 'Malena' starring the absolutely gorgeous Monica Bellucci.



About a young boy who, at the cusp of puberty, falls in love with local widow Malena. The movie is set against the backdrop of world war two and delves into some quite controversial subjects with a some pretty harrowing scenes towards the end too. The movie is just alive with eroticism and Monica Bellucci is just too damn sexy to believe!

The first time you see her, she is being ogled by a group of young boys and seeing her simply walk by was turned into such an event of erotic proportions , can't blame the boy for popping his first boner. I love how the boys,after she has walked on by, then leap onto their bikes and ride forward to their next point where they can sit and watch her walk on by once more.

The scene where he fantasizes about Malena walking into his bedroom and undresses in front of him is just amazing! From the moment she appears in the doorway in that amazing white outfit, all angelic like, to the slow walk to his bedside. After that we get the drawn out moment as he slowly reaches out to her , as he reveals her sensual stockings beneath her dress and then eventually rises up for the golden moment as he gradually undresses her to reveal to most amazing pair of boobs in existence! The sequence only lasts about 80 seconds but god damn is it Erotic!



My favourite mainstream sexual moment and probably the reason why i developed a shota fetish. Just the contrast between the magnificent Monica to the scrawny, shorter boy is what makes this scene so fantastic. You literally live in his shoes for the whole scene and surely his fantasy becomes yours.

 

[jugulear]

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When the talk shifted to MALIZIA, I knew there was another similar-named Italian movie beginning with "M" exploring related turf... I couldn't think of it. Thanks, Motiman! Yes, of course, the wonderful movie MALENA. (Albeit it came out far later than that spoken-of '70s "Golden Era," the year 2000.)

All I recall, really, was a scene where the WWII-era townspeople treated Malena very harshly. I didn't even remember if there was any boy-woman interaction, but I traveled to the movie's IMDb page now, and I see in their comments section evidently there was. (Most of the talk disintegrated to moral nuts accusing anyone interested in such as being "pedos"; those who responded accused the ones who jumped to such conclusions as being Americans. Sigh!)

The movie did star Monica Bellucci, however, and how could you go wrong with her? A couple of years later, she would appear in another movie with sexual controversy (subject being r***, and it was handled as the ugly crime that it is), IRREVERSIBLE. I was delighted to see her recently in the James Bond movie, SPECTRE, and she's still got her luster.

I did fast-forward through MALIZIA via the links I mentioned (unfortunately, the version was in Italian, without subtitles... it was like watching JAV; just as well, because the sync was off), and there is a great "flashlight" scene toward the end where the star prances about in the nude. That Laura Antonelli sure was appealing, beautiful and sexy. (Hmmm! I just reread what Leebar had written, and he called her "middle-aged"; hahh? She looked pretty young to me, and I see now she was maybe 31 or 32 when the movie was shot. Hey, the U.S. Census apparently says middle age begins at 45, and who can argue with the U.S. Census?)

Motiman, you are so right when JAV tries to get away with the casting of "boys" who are tall and blurry-faced, spoiling the illusion. Fact is, it is hard to find an actor such as Urchin (formerly, the Concentration Camp Survivor) who was so effective in some of those DVDES movies. (My favorite in that series is -786, and Urchin was amazing.) Sometimes we have no choice but to try and suspend our disbelief with the ensuing inanities.


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[Inertia]

jugulear: "Urchin" = まーくん (Makkun).

 

[jugulear]

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Thanks, Inertia! Indeed, it was an exciting moment when Member Waxaxa had made this I.D. near the link I provided above, leading to the Good, Bad, Ugly & Tubby thread. I now have made a note in the Urchin post on that thread, to make things clearer.

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[Zen10101]

There's this one casting couch episode that stands out for me: Casting Couch X starring Angel Del Rey. Her performance was worlds apart from any other in the series as she's more reserved and even had an expression of fear during certain points, and it immediately reminded me of JAV. The progression as the "Dude" coaxes her from stripping naked to anal sex felt surprisingly authentic. Sadly I have yet to come across anything in the series or from Del Rey that felt this right.

 

[jugulear]

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Not to pat myself on the back, but I know quality word-of-mouth when I hear it. Me head off here soon.

Yep. Exactly the kind of thing that is missing from stupid American porn, and when it accidentally pops up now and then, do we get surprised.


EDIT:

Preview of Zen's next recommendation, below post; evidently, BRAZZERS actually and refreshingly handled the silly situation in a "real-life" sort of way, if we may call it that. (Bio of the actress.)

http://www.pornhub.com/view_video.php?viewkey=1687187766


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[Zen10101]

I've yet to see this, but it looks pretty freakin hot, could give our JAV news anchors a run for their money.

Monique Alexander - Brazzers Comedy News